Posts by joey jojo

'It takes 6 - 12 months to learn how to properly wear masks'. Really??? I tried to google that statement and found nothing because on the surface your comment sounds like a steaming pile of horse poo. Could you please provide evidence that this is the case. I mean, you could learn a lot of things in 12 months, I find it almost unbelievable that it takes that long to learn how to wear a mask properly. I have nurses in my family and I have never heard of anything like that.

Also, once again, lockdowns definitely work when they are implemented properly. Please take a look at the data from Australia that proves the case. You mention 'worldwide data' but you only cite states in the U.S. as evidence mandated lockdowns don't work. Did those states have strict border closures to prevent unnecessary movement? If so, for how long?

Jhine, I agree with your comment about a conspiracy. You couldn't get Russia and America to agree on the weather, yet they are all in this covid conspiracy together?

56

JW Net and Politics

by snare&racket in

jw
friends

this site was and remains instrumental in assisting people that want to leave the jw's.. there has been political discussion here for some time now, a good couple of years and it makes me feel a little uneasy.

i just opened up the site for the first time in some weeks, of the 10 posts being discussed, 4 were by the same poster, about politics, promoting their right wing beliefs.. this has been the trend for some time now, the same name behind a peppering of posts stirring the right v left of politics.. i remain forever grateful to the site and it's founders simon & angharad, i appreciate that simon shares some of these these political beliefs.

it would be a shame to see the site evolve from a place for jw freedom of thought and escape, to political squabbling, that the world is frankly tired of right now.. just to clarify, politics is my hobby, whilst my friends read the football scores, i'm reading polling data.

joey jojo

It's only natural that outstanding current events will be discussed on a forum like this. I've posted before that Trump era politics seem to be extremely divisive, and conversations on the subject often ended up being counter - productive, 'I'm right, you're wrong' arguments.

Understandably, that becomes tiring after a while.

25

Genesis 1:16 and apologists- vegetation before the Sun?

by joey jojo in

gen 1: 11 says: .

11 then god said, “let the earth sprout [j]vegetation, [k]plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit according to [l]their kind [m]with seed in them”; and it was so.

12 the earth produced [n]vegetation, [o]plants yielding seed according to [p]their kind, and trees bearing fruit [q]with seed in them, according to [r]their kind; and god saw that it was good.

joey jojo

Doing a little bit of digging, I noticed that the Hebrew word for 'heaven' , haš·šā·ma·yim, can also be translated to simply 'sky'. The same word is used at gen 1:1, and again at Gen 1:20 when describing the place birds fly. Knowing that birds dont fly in outer space, Im leaning towards 'the heavens' referring to what we would call the sky above us and not space, containing stars, galaxies etc.

The idea of an opaque, water vapour canopy has always been a bit odd for me, as Gen 1:14 says that the newly created lights in the sky were to serve as signs to mark time and the changing of the seasons. If that was the case, why were they hidden behind a cloud canopy, if the very reason they were made was so humans could see them and tell the time?

25

Genesis 1:16 and apologists- vegetation before the Sun?

by joey jojo in

gen 1: 11 says: .

11 then god said, “let the earth sprout [j]vegetation, [k]plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit according to [l]their kind [m]with seed in them”; and it was so.

12 the earth produced [n]vegetation, [o]plants yielding seed according to [p]their kind, and trees bearing fruit [q]with seed in them, according to [r]their kind; and god saw that it was good.

joey jojo

Phizzy, I agree. At what point do all the inconsistencies reach the point where it all falls down? What do you overlook and what do you accept? Does the decision about what you accept come down to personal experience, or your own world view, or is it based on evidence?

This first chapter in Genesis is a good example of how different people will do whatever it takes to squeeze a square peg into a round hole.

25

Genesis 1:16 and apologists- vegetation before the Sun?

by joey jojo in

gen 1: 11 says: .

11 then god said, “let the earth sprout [j]vegetation, [k]plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit according to [l]their kind [m]with seed in them”; and it was so.

12 the earth produced [n]vegetation, [o]plants yielding seed according to [p]their kind, and trees bearing fruit [q]with seed in them, according to [r]their kind; and god saw that it was good.

joey jojo

Day 4 included sun, moon and stars, which seems to indicate that 'the heavens', if it was already created was simply vast emptiness.

25

Genesis 1:16 and apologists- vegetation before the Sun?

by joey jojo in

gen 1: 11 says: .

11 then god said, “let the earth sprout [j]vegetation, [k]plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit according to [l]their kind [m]with seed in them”; and it was so.

12 the earth produced [n]vegetation, [o]plants yielding seed according to [p]their kind, and trees bearing fruit [q]with seed in them, according to [r]their kind; and god saw that it was good.

joey jojo

Gen 1: 11 says:

11 Then God said, “Let the earth sprout [j]vegetation, [k]plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit according to [l]their kind [m]with seed in them”; and it was so. 12 The earth produced [n]vegetation, [o]plants yielding seed according to [p]their kind, and trees bearing fruit [q]with seed in them, according to [r]their kind; and God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day. (nasb)

Then, in Gen 1:16:

16 God made the two great lights, the greater light [x]to govern the day, and the lesser light [y]to govern the night; He made the stars also. 17 God placed them in the [z]expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth, 18 and [aa]to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening and there was morning, a fourth day. (nasb)

So, according to Genesis, vegetation was created and grew, even produced fruit, for untold eons, before the Sun, or Moon were created.

Its quite amusing to read the mental gymnastics apologists put forward to explain these verses. Everything from light being emitted from black holes, to light being diffused by the good old water vapour canopy. However, the bible verses cant be any clearer to an average person reading them. There are a lot of quotes from JWorg about the accuracy of the bible but here are a couple worth considering:

"ALTHOUGH the Bible is not a science textbook, it is accurate when it discusses the natural world." - IS THE BIBLE REALLY FROM GOD?

Logical conclusion drawn from that statement; we accept the bible as it is written, there is no need to interpret any verses.

Concerning these verses JWorg says:

Myth: The Bible says that vegetation was created before the sun existed to support photosynthesis.—Genesis 1:11, 16.

Fact: The Bible shows that the sun, one of the stars that make up “the heavens,” was created before vegetation. (Genesis 1:1) Diffused light from the sun reached the earth’s surface during the first “day,” or epoch, of creation. As the atmosphere cleared, by the third “day” of creation, the light was strong enough to support photosynthesis. (Genesis 1:3-5, 12, 13) Only later did the sun become distinctly visible from the surface of the earth.—Genesis 1:16. - Does Science Agree With the Bible?

The JW answer is, as usual, misleading and disagrees with the bible account. The bible does not say that the sun was created along with 'the heavens'. It is very clear, the sun and the moon were created on the 4th day, after vegetation. If the first few verses of Genesis are read literally, then 'the heavens' do not include the sun, stars, or the moon.

This all ends in a paradox, either the bible is wrong, or the jw's are wrong. The bible, according to jw's, can't be wrong, but they feel the need to correct the bible account in this instance- even though, according to them, its right.

23

JWs getting into film production what could go wrong

by mickbobcat in

so the cult is getting into film production.

i saw evans piece on the jws opening a studio in australia.

one thing i see is if they use the people who are drawn to acting one they will create internal stars.

joey jojo

One thing I remember about all the pre-taped dramas was the American accent. So funny watching an old school drama acted by the local brothers in some place in Australia that no-one has heard of, miming to American accents.

17

Google threatening to pull search engine from Australia

by joey jojo in

government is saying google should pay fees to news media for aggregating news.

google says they will geo-block australia from search if forced to.

raises some interesting questions about how dependant we have all become and how entangled google is in our lives.

joey jojo

To be fair, if you relying on social media platforms for emergency warnings, you probably need to re-assess your emergency plans.

9

C T Russell and His Numerology.

by Lost in the fog in

i came across this older wt which i assume c t russell wrote the article.

unlike modern practitioners of numerology who calculate a value for each letter of the alphabet, russell simply adds up the number of letters in each word to arrive at [horror of horrors] 666.. and he lists there on the page each one of the organisations that must accordingly be part of the great harlot with 18 letters [in english] in their titles, because 18 is clearly 6+6+6 or 666!

strangely he hasn't stopped to think about another possibility for an 18 letter title.

joey jojo

Despite clearly saying the number is a mans number- or the number of a man, the preceding verse also mentions that you need the mark of the beast to buy or sell. A lot of people seem to think it is referring to Caesar Nero and it certainly makes sense ( to me anyway) if the mark of the beast is simply Nero's image stamped on coins.

As a jw, I was taught that the number is 6, written 3 times for emphasis. This is blatant misinterpretation, as the number is translated as six hundred and sixty six. For whatever reason, jw's even feel the need to twist a basic bible verse like this one. They literally ignore what the verse says and make up their own interpretation.